Can I Register A 2 Stroke Dirtbike In Pa

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• #1

With two strokes being fased out it'll proubably never happen... But I wonder if a two stroke dirt bike had modern fuel injection with the computers and such like street bikes do now... Would they be jetted perfectly no matter were you lot rode it? They would run perfectly no thing the temp, or elevation would'nt they? Plus their would be performance chips, or downloadable "tunes" similar Triumph has on their street bikes... Yous tin can take your Triumph to the dealer and take them download "tunes" right into your bike for next o null... It might even exist free I don't remember... My brother has one... Ducati has the spendy "fries"... I wonder if they'd exist besides heavy or something for MX applications or some other enginnering problem... I bet an enduro wheel with EFI would piece of work for sure... I wonder why information technology has'bne been done already? Just remember yous'd never accept to re jet your bike always again...

• #2

It would probably raise the cost quite a bit...Add unwanted weight, plus because of the mode MX bikes are ridden it may crusade an issue with the function(simply a guess) of the fuel injection with all the jumps...

Jul 25, 1999

iii,721

68

NoVa

• #three

I would think there would be likewise many variables involved. And if it would work for all temps, elevations, riding styles, mix ratios, gas types and engine condition, it would plough a $5599 wheel into a mucho dinero bike.
just my .02, but what practice I know I'm an electrician ;)

• #iv

I think it might happen. Aprilla has fuel injection on its 50cc scooters.

• #five

.. Merely I wonder if a 2 stroke dirt bike had mod fuel injection with the computers and such similar street bikes do at present... .

You mean similar the Straight Injection version Physician built and brought to Dirtweek final year?

Click this link for more info :

http://www.dirtrider.cyberspace/forums3/showthread.php?t=86046

• #six

Fuel injection systems don't accept to be extremely complex nor add significant weight. The fuel can be delivered according to a mass-air-flow meter which in conjunction with a relatively simple computer would account for changes in air density (altitude, weather). It'south probably unrealistic to expect a computer to 'automatically' adapt for premix ratio and octane, although knock sensors can certainly go some way to providing a margin of safety or failsafe mechanism for changes in fuel quality. Certainly the manufacturers would accept to tackle the effect of providing the owner with a simple means to adjust the air-fuel ratio (jetting). Hooking upward a laptop computer is not going to exist an acceptable solution for most people, only toggle-switches or a dial on the computer facilitating fine-tuning might be ok. To significantly change the fueling you'd maybe need to visit your dealership for an ECM reflash, who might have a program say for 91 octane, and another for race gas, whatever..

I too suspect that FI would necessitate a move away from premix to an oil injection arrangement. I've used such systems on two-stroke streetbikes (in the United kingdom). They were reliable for the nigh office and did permit ratio adjustment.

Regardless, fuel injection isn't rocket science past any means. Correct at present it'south simply easier for the manufacturers to cater to the growing four-stroke market.

-Step

• #7

Honda already used Fuel Injection on two stroke GP road racers in the early to mid 1990's. With all the work they did they could run it at present. Funny though Mick Doohan found them no better in performance than the carby jobs. Equally Rich pointed FI two strokes are a reality. Will they always brand it to mass production.........maybe non.

• #8

My hunch is that it will happen at some signal in the time to come. Much the same as the four-stroke dirt-bike was resurrected in role due to legislation, but likewise because one of the manufacturers realized that an old provision in the rulebooks would requite them an unfair reward if they could invest in the technology. I recall the ii-stroke will die out, and a company such as KTM or Yamaha volition subsequently corner a 'niche' market place on them and pioneer a clean burning 2-stroke dirtbike platform.

On a related topic: I believe that the legislators volition expect until the ii-stroke is as skillful as dead, and then they'll offset neutering the thumpers through unreasonable noise regs. The stage has already been set, really.

2-fume: How practice you like that 300EX/C? How does the ability compare to a 250 MX machine?

-Pace

• #9

If they can get the delayed response EFI has then it would exist great, otherwise I can see striking jumps right out of corners being tricky or going through tight woods and singletrack causing issues.

Jul 25, 1999

3,721

68

NoVa

• #11

2-smoke: How practise you lot like that 300EX/C? How does the power compare to a 250 MX machine?

-Pace[/QUOTE]

To exist honest (and probably reverse to what others say) Ive always found the 300 and Ive ridden diverse models up to 2003 model to be much easier than the 250. It has enough of hit but is delivered in a pretty smooth manner and the extra torque allows yous to be lazier with gears if your not on the ball and still go upwards the loma. 300EXC compared to a 250 MX is much smoother and easier to ride.....and I aint no superstar!!

• #12

We will encounter 2 stroke clay bikes with FI. But the manufacturers aren't finished selling u.s. iv strokes all the same. Once they saturate the market place with 4-strokes they'll innovate their next "new" applied science...clean burning 2 strokes with straight injection.

What'due south sometime is new again.

• #13

Affair is cars run efi and theres a huge trade in new maps for the ecu, then instead of $four for a jet yous need $200 for a new map.

• #14

Fuel injection won't change the fundamental trouble with two-strokes, as far as the EPA is concerned. Y'all'll still have to put oil in the gas and it's those actress hydrocarbons which are the trouble. They greatly increase frazzle emissions, which is the EPA's big beef with two-strokes. The merely way you lot can solve that one is to become the crankcase lubrication and fuel separated, which is completely contrary to normal 2-stroke design.

• #15

We volition run across 2 stroke dirt bikes with FI. make clean called-for 2 strokes with directly injection.

Maybe that's what Honda is hiding, that or the fifth (it would be fifth, correct?) generation of their aluminum frame. It'southward something. I incertitude they'd look until September just to build suspense.

Personally, every bit for FI and functioning, I don't see why they need to carp. In my feel, modern 2-strokes are so powerful, and then light so simple to piece of work on that 99.nine% of the people who purchase and ride them would not do good from FI. I would rather exist able to work on the affair myself than add on some other bell and/or whistle that I'd take to take to the dealer to service. If you can't modify or pay to have your carbed two-stroke modified to fit the performance or power-delivery you lot want for less than what the cost of FI would exist, you are lying to yourself -- either near your own abilities or your bike's.

Nonetheless, if FI is what's needed to brand them environmentally friendly plenty so we tin keep buying them (would FI really aid in this, though?), then so exist it.

But think, if one of these manufacturers would develop a new four-stroke that was just equally powerful, 25 lbs. lighter, revs twice equally fast, is more than reliable and simpler to piece of work on, with ameliorate (lower CoG) treatment characteristics and automatically adjusting valves, I'd buy it. Until and then, I'grand sticking with my two-stroke, which has all the above RIGHT NOW!

• #16

The only thing that bothers me more than having an elephant jumping up and down on my gonads, is hearing...over and over...again and again...people talking about the '2 stroke dying'...the '2 stroke is expressionless'. Hey, I'grand not a diehard 2 fan that'south scheming to kill off the thumper. Naah. I like thumpers a lot. Problem is, no 1 seems to think they tin coexist. If there'southward whatsoever one 'picture' that sums the story upwardly, it's this: If a top fuel dragster is allowed, for closed form competition, NM:EtOH (?not even sure if that'southward right, let lone the ratio), to compete and spew less than environmentally friendly fumes from i finish to the other, the little 2 stroke fella volition exist allowed to do the same. News flash! AMA, EPA, AMA-EPA has never announced any single restriction on whatsoever type of cycle in closed form racing--equally regards pollution. Why do people think the simple two is going away?

Seems information technology'due south all smoke and mirrors--threatening the trail and off route guys otherwise first (this is where Doc practical his craft) with the 06 EPA Kali regs. I don't call back this is going to be a difficult thing to whip, since that type of cycle is easier to inject than an all-out screaming 125 eg.

The other attribute of that question....if the ii was going away, why was this the biggest yr for 2 development (that I can remember). Unless we're looking at what was begun six years ago and they're just finishing it up. Completely new designs. Aluminum frames. etc.......

• #17

If a top fuel dragster is immune, for closed course competition, NM:EtOH (?not fifty-fifty sure if that'south correct, let lonely the ratio), to compete and spew less than environmentally friendly fumes from one cease to the other, the little 2 stroke fella volition exist allowed to do the same. News flash! AMA, EPA, AMA-EPA has never announced whatsoever single restriction on any blazon of bike in closed course racing--as regards pollution. Why do people recall the simple 2 is going away?

I estimate because you tin't meander down to the corner automobile dealership and buy a summit fuel dragster for six grand. I can see their point. I can see yours, likewise, which for the tape I call back makes more sense. Two strokes aren't going anywhere.

if the two was going away, why was this the biggest yr for ii development (that I can remember).

Yes! The 2005 model year is the best for 2-strokes since...since...1988? I think the KX, CR and definitely the YZ 250s were all considered very strong simply unique that yr. Don't remember how the RM 250 fared, though. The CR125 was definitely getting kudos then.

I think nosotros tin can fifty-fifty brand the statement virtually 2005 without fifty-fifty seeing the CR250 notwithstanding. The RM and YZ are certainly going to be awesome, and the KX is all new, with attention paid where attention was needed. Throw in this YZ125 "superbike" and information technology is a neat yr.

You definitely bring up a good question to debate. Which model year featured the most new, refined, polished and relatively advanced (remember, nosotros're talking improved vs. previous years here...not vs. today...duh!) two-stroke motocross bikes equally does 2005?

I say 1988. Anyone else?

• #18

I dunno nigh an verbal year (too many beers since and so) but I'd say that 81ish/82ish range saw a lot of improvements with water-cooling and everyone scrapping the dual rear shocks except Yamaha who already pioneered the Monoshock earlier. Of class in that location was the awesome dual shock Maico 490 too. I retrieve my 82 RM250Z and how superior that bike was to other earlier bikes both in terms of engine and the new Total Floater intermission. That was a great bike just that year Honda, Yamaha and Kawasaki all had nice bikes out so it was a difficult decision. My local dealer had Hondas and Suzukis. I wanted the CR initially merely the RM was in stock and after a quick test ride effectually the field next door and the deal he offered, I was sold. This year looks like I'll have a tough decision on a 250 over again. I uncertainty I'll get to ride them all and then it probably is going to come down to price, availability and to a indicate, other's opinions.

Scott

• #19

[ The merely style you can solve that i is to go the crankcase lubrication and fuel separated, which is completely contrary to normal two-stroke design.[/QUOTE]
Actually all of your 2 stroke diesels do exactly that. The 53,71,92 and 149 series detroits all seperate the crankcase oil from the combustion process. But fifty-fifty with EFI and super loftier injection pressures, etc they were still non able to meet the standards for diesel fuel engine emissions that the EPA has gear up. Thus they are no longer produced, even though in that location are millions of them in service worldwide. Wouldn't it be much easier to outlaw environmentalists?

• #20

Of grade at that place was the awesome dual shock Maico 490 as well. I remember my 82 RM250Z and how superior that bike was to other earlier bikes both in terms of engine and the new Full Floater pause.

Proficient call. The big Maico and the '82 RM were supposed to be incredible machines (I've never ridden either). Plus, with the other manufacturers coming out with advancements such as linkage and water cooling, that was a nice era for advancement. However, initial stabs at both certainly were failures in some cases (first year Kaw Unilink and Yamaha's radiator on the fork thing).

Powervalves and disc brakes were the next step.

And so, all seemed to reach a certain level of refinement in the late 1980s.

The biggest advocacy in the 1990s, in my opinion, was ergos. Of form, other things, such equally reliability and interruption, were considerably refined further, but raw performance had started to level off. Powerjets? Electronically controlled powervalves? Overnice, but zip big, actually.

• #21

Actually all of your ii stroke diesels do exactly that.

How does the wristpin bearing get lubed? Does it need it?

• #22

The 2 wheel diesel has an oil pump just similar a 4 wheel diesel and oil is sprayed under the piston for cooling and to lubricate the wrist pin, cams exhaust valves etc. A 2 cycle diesel is much more circuitous than a ii cycle motorcycle engine. If your interested here is a expert commodity on ii bike vs iv bike diesels. The aforementioned battles are being fought here. Every bit HP numbers go up reliability comes down.
http://www.yachtsurvey.com/comparing_diesel_types.htm

• #23

Anyone remeber the ATK EFI bikes ? I read a 1992 article on them and they said on the adept side the bicycle runs clean and the computer adjusts the air/fuel ratio for the altitude and so there's no need for adjustments like you would have on a caburator...They aslo gave compliments to easier starting with EFI.

On the downside yous have to have a fuel pump and more electronic gadgetry that can be messed up and it's a bit more than expensive to supplant if y'all take a failure..Plus it adds a chip more weight than a carburator...
I ran across the article today and remembered this topic..Just thought I would share it with you lot..

• #24

Ski-doo makes a fuel injected two-stroke motor for the mxz-rev snowmobile called the Rotax ii-tec. The post-obit was copied from their website and is the sales pitch for the motor:

The revolutionary no-compromises cleaner-burning Rotax 2-stroke engine. Fuel is injected into the transfer ports once the exhaust ports are closed. This semi-straight injection procedure reduces emissions past as much as l percent and fuel economy by as much as 25 percent, with the same power as a carbureted engine. The two-TEC SDI delivers two-stroke low-cal weight and loftier performance with 4-stroke emissions and fuel economy.

Although a snowmobile is non as lite equally a dirtbike, the aforementioned rules of power vs. weight withal apply. information technology does not seem unreasonable to believe that the 2-stroke will be "brought back from the dead," by this type of applied science.

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Can I Register A 2 Stroke Dirtbike In Pa,

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